Black nose genetics question

[Angie Panczak]

Thanks! She has Flashdance in her pedigree, so she could be a carrier.

 

[Anatole Cannon]

My male has a black nose my female has a pink nose, all her kittens have pink noses. Could she ever have a black nose kitten if she doesn't carry for black noses?

I think that the black nosed gene is a polygenic partial recessive/dominant, and I think it is tied in with black masking. Sometimes you'll get a black nose that stays black, but doesn't have that black colour going up the nose bridge and down the whisker pads, and sometimes you do. The reason I think it is polygenic is that I have had a black nosed stud (Dream) for a couple years with several kittens on the ground, but ZERO black nosed kittens from him. However, the same pink nosed girls bred to a different stud (Flashdance) have given me several black noses in each litter. The litter from Oya has a light warmer toned kitten and a darker cool toned kitten, though neither have the black mask. The ones from Ninja's litter are varying degrees of cool toned but have both the black nose and the black mask, and one with a black nose but no mask. I also have a litter from Terra, who is a dream daughter, but has a pink nose, bred to Flashdance. ALL those kittens have black noses, and 3 of the 5 have black masks. Christine also tells me that Flashdance will usually give at least one black nosed kitten (a true black nose that stays black, rather than one that seems black at birth but then fades to brick or pink. I've had tons of faders.) in each litter, regardless of the mother's nose colour. So I think the more genes a cat has that are related to the black nose dictate how strongly the black noses are passed on. I think at least one of those genes has to be dominant or a partial dominant, as in Flash, and some are recessive. I think Dream has the recessive genes and none of the dominant, and I think Flash has sets of both dominant and recessive. Flash does have black traveling about halfway up his nosebridge, and I think (it's hard to tell because he's so dark and cool-toned) a little down onto his whisker pads. Dream has black traveling about 1/4 of the way up his nosebridge but i don't think any down his whisker pads, but he is also very dark and cool-toned, so hard to tell with him too.

 

[MK Anderson]

Keeba has a awesome black nose. I know his mom had a black nose and father didnt. not sure about grandparents on down.

 

[feedtheflame]

I had originally wanted a kitten with a black nose, but oh well...his is rimmed with black and im excited to see how he develops. Servals dont always have black noses though..ive seen ones that are streaked with pink atleast...

 

[Angie Panczak]

Thanks everyone. Guess it's Kindof not straight forward, huh. I appreciate all your feedback though. Your analogy is very insightful Anatole!

 

[Brigitte Cowell]

We also have to remember that when dealing with expression of genes, those 50-50 or 25% chances of a gene being inherited are theoretical and the litters that you actually get don't always follow that split. Example, we once bred a marble female to a spotted male that we knew carried for marble (his mother was marble)... expecting that one kitten would be spotted, but ALL kittens were marble. It should have been 50% spotted, 50% marble. But it's a 50-50 chance for each kitten.

Just because you don't get that recessive trait, doesn't mean it isn't there...

 

[scorpius]

I had originally wanted a kitten with a black nose, but oh well...

trust me, you don't . black nosers are really brown nosers - LoL! Mine is always kissing up to me in front of his big bro who is a pink noser. he likes to show off this way to impress me. I'm sure it's because of his black nose dj

 

[rypka]

We also have to remember that when dealing with expression of genes, those 50-50 or 25% chances of a gene being inherited are theoretical and the litters that you actually get don't always follow that split. Example, we once bred a marble female to a spotted male that we knew carried for marble (his mother was marble)... expecting that one kitten would be spotted, but ALL kittens were marble. It should have been 50% spotted, 50% marble. But it's a 50-50 chance for each kitten.

Just because you don't get that recessive trait, doesn't mean it isn't there...

exactly, that is what I was trying to say

 

[Anatole Cannon]

Thanks everyone. Guess it's Kindof not straight forward, huh. I appreciate all your feedback though. Your analogy is very insightful Anatole!

I'm not sure what help I was. I think my take on the gene(s) just makes things a lot more complicated.

 

[Anatole Cannon]

We also have to remember that when dealing with expression of genes, those 50-50 or 25% chances of a gene being inherited are theoretical and the litters that you actually get don't always follow that split. Example, we once bred a marble female to a spotted male that we knew carried for marble (his mother was marble)... expecting that one kitten would be spotted, but ALL kittens were marble. It should have been 50% spotted, 50% marble. But it's a 50-50 chance for each kitten.

Just because you don't get that recessive trait, doesn't mean it isn't there...

Yes, this is very true. And while I agree with what you are saying for simple recessives, I don't think the black nose gene is a simple recessive.