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Isoflurane

admin

Paige
Staff member
#11
From what I understand, some higher generation Savannahs have smaller livers and lower blood values from the serval ancestor that does not metabolize the ketamine well. As mine are lower gens, and my vet is comfortable using the isoflurane, that is the route we will go. For the record, most of the kittens I have sold (F4 and F7) had surgery with ketamine (the rest used iso) with no problems.
My vet is great and will do whatever I want :big grin:
 

AundreaLea

Site Supporter
#12
I'm with you, I would be very careful with the lower generations. I have F6 A's and after I did my research I didn't feel the need to ask my vet to treat them any different than any other domestic cat since the percentage of serval is very little at this point.
 
#13
I just don't want to risk anything; I love her so much. On top of that, she is a very tiny cat and one of her kidneys is smaller than the other so I want to take extra precautions especially with any medication that metabolism in the liver and kidneys.... should I worry about medications/anesthesia dosing with a smaller kidney? her blood panel was normal. Maybe the vet was looking at her liver and thought it was a kidney LOL I wouldn't be surprised with the vets I have been dealing with thus far. :[

Edit: Should I wait until after her first cycle to spay her? Or just do it right at 6 months?
 

Pam Flachs

Savannah Super Cat
#15
....nor wait until her first cycle. Most vets won't spay them during a heat cycle; mine doesn't anyway, I believe the tissue is softer at that time. And if she has a heat cycle before spaying, there's always the risk she will get outside and get bred...their instincts at that time are very strong! Plus some intact girls spray...one of mine does :/
 

Wyldthingz

Savannah Super Cat
#16
Yes, I know exactly why they insist on premeds in combo with iso anesthetic because it's CHEAPER! My vet is the biggest cheap skate in the world but some animals, she will only use iso. It is also more difficult. When you give a premed, the "excitement" stage is shorter than using Iso alone. The excitement stage is when the muscles begin to relax and they twitch and fight like crazy. They are technically out cold and unaware of everything but they start jumping around and it can take 2 or 3 people to prevent them from getting injured. I have actually sat on a Akita that did just that and it was no easy task.

You can ask your vet that you are willing to pay more for iso alone. We have used "cocktails" with iso on my Savannahs with no issues. I think it is somewhat a misnomer that Savannahs can't tolerate premeds. I don't believe it, but if your contract spells that out, then do it. I think if you are polite and explain that it is your agreement with the breeder to do so I think they will be more understanding?
 

Wyldthingz

Savannah Super Cat
#17
I know what you mean but...I like to see the research and data behind it...and I wonder how many savannah breeders and owners use ketamine...or a ketamine mix...I bet it is a lot more than you would think and I also bet the incidents of something going wrong is the same as any other anesthetic, but I am just guessing...now for servals...that is a different story...or even F1's or F2's...I just want to know the rationale behind not using it.
I have a feeling that one cat had an issue then everyone jumped the bandwagon that ketamine is dangeous. Most issues and deaths are actually caused by sloppy, unattentive vets and tecnicians. The animal under anestic are not monitored well and they don't notice that "gee, he's not breathing?" I walked into a vet's office once and no one was around and the dog was laid out with no one in the room. I was shocked. Where I worked, we were never allowed to walk away with an animal under anesthesia and the vet never left the office. Not every practice is that conscientious.
 

Patti

Admin
Staff member
#18
There have been several adverse incidences documented with ketamine use (not just Savannahs), the two that come to mind are the two cats that were totally freeked out as though on speed for hours after their neuter, and the two kittens who died during neuter with ketamine. Possibly incidental but this never happened to either of these breeders' other cats when ketamine was not used.

On the other hand, you do not want to ask a vet to use an alternative agent such as propofol if they are not familiar with the drug - that can lead to disastrous results as well.
 

Wyldthingz

Savannah Super Cat
#19
My vet has used Ketamine for years in all breeds with no adverse effect. It does have a hallucinatory effect in cats in general, which in some cats will take more time to clear the system.
 

admin

Paige
Staff member
#20
There have been several adverse incidences documented with ketamine use (not just Savannahs), the two that come to mind are the two cats that were totally freeked out as though on speed for hours after their neuter, and the two kittens who died during neuter with ketamine. Possibly incidental but this never happened to either of these breeders' other cats when ketamine was not used.

On the other hand, you do not want to ask a vet to use an alternative agent such as propofol if they are not familiar with the drug - that can lead to disastrous results as well.
But several instances should not dictate what an entire population of pet owners and breeders do...and who knows...maybe the dosage was off or something else happened. I'm not saying there cannot be adverse effects with ketamine, I just have not seen anything scientific or any kind of research that would or rationale that would lead me to believe that all savannahs should not have ketamine. Just does not make sense to me.